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#91
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yes, the disc is exactly the same, there's no difference
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#92
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Seems like I jumped the gun with this and my apologies for doing so. Some great stuff on here and the vast majority is better than the original (although I'm sure some of it identical.)
I am still however, disappointed with the Blu Ray Release @ 5k Yen *EDIT* Just ordered it =/ I've been hammering the game now and at first I thought why did they change a good thing, but the more you go into it the more you realise that the majority of it is actually better. Especially Seymour battle theme.... Need to buy a blu ray rom now for my PC so I can get the damn MP3s off of it... Last edited by Boyblunder; Apr 16, 2014 at 06:08 AM. |
#93
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Here's an article about this remaster soundtrack on Polygon, with quotes from the composers and other experts.
The article's writer even links to this very forum when she writes about the public response! |
#94
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added to notes:
aggregated compostion- and arrangement credits + Quote:
Last edited by DanteLectro; Jan 18, 2015 at 01:03 PM. |
#95
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I updated the times for OMAKE 2 and OMAKE 3 as well as 104, while most of the track times were off by +/- 1 second (expected), OMAKE 2 was off by 2 seconds, OMAKE 3 was off by 8 and 104 was off by 2. I also validated the times from the audio I ripped from the Bluray to the times from the mp3s provided on the disc and they matched up, so I don't know where those previous ones came from but my edits should be good.
*edit* reverted track name changes per booklet. Last edited by dancey; Aug 1, 2015 at 08:52 PM. |
#96
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Someone pointed out that there is massive clipping on track 12. This is on the bluray source but not on the mp3 versions so it further confirms what _if was saying -- SQEX is just upsampling their 16/44.1 source to 24/96 and doing a very poor job. I don't know what other ones clip but if anyone finds any other tracks that do, feel free to post them here.
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#97
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Having played the HD version of the game recently, I thought I'd come here to see what people are saying about it. I'm honestly kind of surprised that "Movement In Green" got as much praise as it did because it has a fairly significant technical glitch that I'm surprised nobody caught when they were rearranging it.
The original version of the track has the accordion playing melody and chords. For some reason, the HD remaster version is using a monophonic virtual accordion, so you don't hear those chords. ...mostly. There are occasional rests in the melody, and one of the notes from the underlying chord pokes through when it gets to those rests. It's honestly one of the most irritating things for me, and it baffles me that nobody noticed/fixed it during production, especially since they worked on the track enough to extend it to double the length of the original. It's not that they couldn't do a polyphonic accordion, either, since they have one come in later in the track (and run back and forth across the stereo spectrum for who knows what reason). EDIT: Just wanted to come back to say I did some digging into the original music data for the PS2 version of the track. If they did use a monophonic accordion patch in the new version as I theorized, they didn't just use the same MIDI data from the original version. If they used the original as a base, they would have needed to extend certain notes to get those notes to poke through during the rests in the melody. Last edited by JRokujuushi; May 6, 2017 at 03:45 PM. Reason: New research |
#98
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I noticed the removal of the accordion chords as well, and it's one of the reasons I don't like the HD version as much either - although for me, it's one of this OST's lesser disappointments (of which there are many).
However, if you're talking about the monophonic note snapping that can be heard in the accordion lead in the A section, I don't agree that it's an unintended technical glitch - or at least, I don't interpret it as such. I don't think what you're hearing there is the previously existing chords unintentionally "poking through" the rests, but a deliberate attempt to simulate rapid compression and expansion of the accordion bellows as a performance articulation in the line. It's not a very convincing attempt, but I did take it as the effect Nakano was after. As you observed yourself, that monophonic note snapping action was achieved by specifically extending an underlying pedal tone through the entire duration of the melodic phrase, so that that tone would sound during any breaks in the melody line. If the intent had been to preserve the chords, this would be a very odd, and difficult, mistake to make. Removing the accordion chords from the melody line does have a noticeable stylistic effect, rendering the line more spare and lonely, and emphasizing its contour against the background harmony. So I can believe that Nakano felt the chords interfered with the particular expression he was seeking, and can understand his rationale in that sense, but I disagree that it was a good choice. The effect makes the piece feel emptier, rather than more elegant. Those chords created a really nice, warm harmonic sheen in the original, and ironically made for a more convincing evocation of how a real accordion would play than the concerted effort to do so in the HD version. I also preferred the original's peculiar, synthetic woodwind-like tone that takes over in the B section, to the simple erhu that replaced it in the HD version. Just another example of the HD version's tendency to replace ambiguous, exotic synth textures with straightforward live sampled ones, because, I suppose, "more real = more better". |
#99
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Interesting that you mention the erhu. I took a look at that part when I was digging through the music data in the PS2 version, and when played in isolation it sounds like an erhu there as well, just more obviously sampled and lo-fi due to the sequenced nature of the music. Personally, I always thought the erhu had a weird woodwind-like quality to its sound, and it blew my mind when I discovered it was actually a bowed string instrument.
As for the accordion bit, I'll totally admit I don't know much about the inner workings of an accordion, so that option hadn't even occurred to me. Even so, maybe I'm just not understanding it the way you describe it but I'm not seeing how it would work. I know about overblowing by forcing more air than intended, but that tends to make things play at a higher pitch instead of lower. I know about disonoric accordions where the pitch changes depending on if it's being compressed or expanded, but that would make the lower note change pitch when the higher note does. If there's something else, my ignorance prevents me from seeing it. Whatever the case, it's either a weird creative decision or a weird oversight of a technical issue, and I don't think it sounds good. |
#100
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I could be wrong myself, but my reaction was that the use of an accordion vst playing in monophonic mode was unrelated to the removal of the chords. I got the impression Nakano just wanted to remove those chords to focus attention on the melodic line, and also, at the same time, tried to exploit the pitch-snapping effect of monophonic MIDI note overlaps to convey the particular staccato-like interplay between keyboard and buttonboard notes that's often heard in accordion music. That is, it seemed to me that the snapbacks to the lower pitches, in between the melodic notes, were meant to suggest notes played quickly on the bellows buttonboard, possibly in conjunction with a quick change of direction in the pumping of the bellows. I can see how the issue is confusing though, because there's no reason you'd *have* to use monophonic overlaps in order to convey such articulations, and I don't know why Nakano bothered.
It just never occurred to me it could be an error, mainly because of the coherent stylistic change and its technical consistency (we don't hear any sloppiness where, say, an inner or bass chord tone plays instead of the melody). The accordion sequence data from FFX played back through a monophonic patch wouldn't sound quite the same as what we hear in the HD version, so I assumed it was intentional. But I totally agree that it doesn't sound good and Nakano achieved nothing by monkeying with it. Interesting about that erhu sound. After I heard the HD version, I could see retroactively how the original timbre had a sort of erhu-ish quality too, but I always thought it sounded like a weird cross between a duduk and an ewi. I liked how ambiguous and artificial that timbre was. Putting a straight erhu in the new version killed a little bit of the piece's magic for me. |
#101
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Quote:
I think Troy Strand and his brass quintet did a good job by turning the original bland track into a far more interesting amd quirky piece. Still annoying, but better than the soundtrack's version. I'm currently playing FFX Remaster and listening to its soundtrack (where I always tend to switch the audio to "Original" instead of "Remastered" lol, because most of the arrangements suck). God, this is a pure nightmare, especially compared to the magnificent FFXII: The Zodiac Age, which I played before. Last edited by Mac_Tear; Jul 25, 2020 at 05:20 AM. |
#102
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Quote:
In all seriousness you're right, it's a great arrangement. This kind of transformation is how you rescue broken music.
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Soundcloud | A'deo Chronicle OST | Horse Isle 2 OST | Mega Man XA | Royalty-Free Music Vol.1 |
#103
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I just added this part to the album notes, taken from the booklet (missing from the notes all these years for some reason).
Quote:
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#104
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Wanted to bring this up: the wiki notes that for the track Zanarkand, the credits differ in the booklet and the official website.
Quote:
Quote:
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#105
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I guess "Zanarkand" technically has the same arrangement as the PS2 version. The notes are the same, just the volume and the tempo is changed in parts. My guess would be it was "arranged" by Hamauzu and the booklet is wrong. I think there's only two such piano tracks in the game, one being "Zanarkand" and the other being "Via Purifico". The interesting thing is that Aki Kuroda is credited for performing on piano for both of these tracks. But while "Via Purifico" sounds like it's straight-up lifted from the FF10 Piano Collections, "Zanarkand" isn't and sounds like an entirely new recording. I find it hard to believe they brought Kuroda back just for that. |
#106
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Kuroda being credited for it lends even more evidence to Hamauzu being the one responsible. Last edited by DDubs; Mar 13, 2024 at 05:43 PM. |
#107
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Quote:
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#108
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Quote:
Last edited by DDubs; Mar 16, 2024 at 11:18 AM. |
#109
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Quote:
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#110
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Quote:
Looking at the original PS2 album credits, Yoko Mori is credited for playing the piano in the original. According to FFX Ultimania Omega, her recording was added at the last minute, and up until then, the game used a temporary recording done by Uematsu himself. Is it possible that this temporary recording ended up in HD as a "new arrangement"? That'd be pretty goofy if so, but it would explain why Uematsu is credited for the track. But then why would Kuroda be credited? Yeah, I don't know. If Kuroda was the one that performed the arrangement, it doesn't make sense why they'd do a new recording and not just reuse the one off the Piano Collection. Actually, since the original PS2 version was a real piano anyway, why did they bother redoing it in the first place? If the whole point was to replace the PS2 midis with live instruments, why would they replace something that was already live? |
#111
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Quote:
Quote:
I like the idea that they dug up Uematsu's temporary recording and reused it for the remaster. I never knew about that. I just checked the Ultimania Omega interview and Uematsu indeed says he played the piano himself. As for the reason they redid the piece for the remaster: that could be due to the low sampling rate it had in the original game. But that's also the reason that makes the theory about using Uematsu's preliminary performance unlikely. As not even the OST uses uncompressed samples based on Mori's performance, I don't think Square Enix held onto Uematsu's uncompressed recording for the last twenty years. They probably scrapped everything they didn't need anymore right after the game was released. They didn't re-render the FMVs for the remaster either (even though they are less compressed than the PS2 files). To top things off, the HD Remaster track has a sampling rate closer to 22.050 KHz. In summary: guess we'll never know what really happened here until someone asks Hamauzu how exactly "Zanarkand" was re-recorded. Edit: If you listen closely, you can hear the pedal in some parts of the HD Remaster version. So we can at least verify it's based on a live performance...and sloppily edited. Last edited by zierts; Mar 17, 2024 at 12:11 AM. |
#112
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Just to chime in on the To Zanakand HD issue, because I recall pondering this when this album first came out: Yeah, it's the exact same track as the original but performed live. That would explain why Uematsu is credited: because the arrangement wasn't altered in any way. So no arranger credit is necessary.
As to who played it? *shrug* Almost certainly wasn't Kuroda though. Uematsu's original recording? Maybe. Someone just ask him lol. It's 2024. He'll be on so many interview circuits in the intervening years between now and his 'official' retirement, one of you surely has connections.
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