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  #1  
Old Nov 19, 2014, 09:22 PM
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Despatche Despatche is offline
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This album has some... "usage descriptions", I don't really know what to call them. The Amazon page for the album has them, though tracks 2 and 15 are written with kana there... odd.

Problem is, another thing the album has are those stretched-out arrow-like brackets... can anyone provide those?
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  #2  
Old Nov 19, 2014, 09:25 PM
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you mean 〈〉 or <>
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  #3  
Old Nov 19, 2014, 09:27 PM
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argh connection crapped out when i was trying to edit

yes, the first ones there, thank you.

edit: nvm found a proper link

edit: oh didn't notice that reprints get their tracklists changed too. crap.

Last edited by Despatche; Nov 19, 2014 at 09:33 PM.
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  #4  
Old Aug 16, 2015, 07:09 PM
BlazingAbyss BlazingAbyss is offline
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From what I can tell, the note on track 8 "〈梵…ドノヴァンのテーマ〉" means that it's Donovan's theme.

I'm not certain what the deal is with "梵…" though. Google translates it to "Brahma," but I think it also translates to Buddhist which would make more sense as I recall that in the English dub at least a few characters wondered if he was some sort of monk, hence it might be something like "Buddhist...Theme of Donavan," but I'm not 100% certain on that.

Though something I must say I find kind of strange though is that only Morrigan, Donovan, and Pyron get notes that specifically state that a song is their theme despite it being pretty clear that a least a few other songs are meant to be specific character themes as well. For example, the track "Chaos Flare" is also the name of one of Demitri's special attacks and I only recall it ever playing during his fight scenes.

Last edited by BlazingAbyss; Aug 16, 2015 at 07:12 PM.
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  #5  
Old Jan 13, 2022, 11:35 PM
BlazingAbyss BlazingAbyss is offline
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I had a question about track 11, "SATSU-JIN." From what I understand, satsu-jin simply means "murder," (I'm not sure if the hyphen here changes anything or not since most examples I've seen online lack it,) but for some reason the release by Viz instead translates it as "Murder Pentagram." I'm not sure if this is accurate or not, but I heard that this particular translation might be a play on words because apparently the character for "five" can also be pronounced as "satsu" and that would in turn correlate with the number of points on a pentagram.

Furthermore the description text next to the title appears to be "殺陣" which seems to mean "sword battle/fight/etc." (I believe this note is referring to how this track plays during the introduction of Hannya, the bloodthirsty cursed armor,) but the part that's confusing is that the romaji for this is apparently also "satsujin." Thus, I'm uncertain if this means that "both "murder" and "sword battle" are accurate translations for this track or if there's some other detail that I'm unaware of/overlooking here.
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Old Jan 14, 2022, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
I had a question about track 11, "SATSU-JIN." From what I understand, satsu-jin simply means "murder,"
That is true, if the Kanji after it was 「殺人」but as you noted, they specified「殺陣」.

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Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
for some reason the release by Viz instead translates it as "Murder Pentagram." I'm not sure if this is accurate or not, but I heard that this particular translation might be a play on words because apparently the character for "five" can also be pronounced as "satsu" and that would in turn correlate with the number of points on a pentagram.
I did a quick search but I couldn't find any connection between 5 (both 五 and 伍) and pentagram.

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Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
Furthermore the description text next to the title appears to be "殺陣" which seems to mean "sword battle/fight/etc."
I can't comment based on the anime context, but「殺陣」refers specifically to sword fights in movies and TV (with origins in Kabuki theatre). It should be the equivalent of "stage combat". Apparently, it was originally written as「殺人」 but changed to 「殺陣」.

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Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
I'm not certain what the deal is with "梵…" though. Google translates it to "Brahma," but I think it also translates to Buddhist which would make more sense as I recall that in the English dub at least a few characters wondered if he was some sort of monk, hence it might be something like "Buddhist...Theme of Donavan," but I'm not 100% certain on that.
Religious topics is above my pay grade but from the Japanese explanations/interpretations I read, Brahman means the fundamental principles of the universe in Hindu/Indian philosophy and can also refer to one of the Gods in Brahmanism and Buddhism. So I think translating it to "buddhist" might be selling it a bit short so either "Bon" (the reading), or "Brahman" should be fine.
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Old Jan 19, 2022, 08:19 PM
BlazingAbyss BlazingAbyss is offline
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Originally Posted by layzee View Post
That is true, if the Kanji after it was 「殺人」but as you noted, they specified「殺陣」.

I can't comment based on the anime context, but「殺陣」refers specifically to sword fights in movies and TV (with origins in Kabuki theatre). It should be the equivalent of "stage combat". Apparently, it was originally written as「殺人」 but changed to 「殺陣」.
I'm not sure if it really changes anything or not, but I can provide some more context since this track is only used for about 2 minutes in the OVA (this is the scene where it is used.) As mentioned before it's used during the introduction of Hannya, the cursed living armor and Bishamon, the samurai ghost who the armor is possessing. Using his sword, "Kien" he effortlessly slaughters some bandits before turning his attention to the bandit's targets. During this he also states that in order to become worthy of wearing him and gaining his power for yourself you must first defeat his current host. He also makes his love for killing and bloodshed quite apparent as well.

Due to this I initially thought that "Murder" or "Slaughter" would be the most accurate translation, but that doesn't appear to be the case since as we've already established, they used "殺陣" and not "殺人." "Stage Combat" wouldn't really fit the context here, but I suppose "Sword Fight" would still work. Though the battle in question is so completely one-sided that I hesitate to even really call it a "fight."

Interestingly, while looking for other examples of "殺陣" I came across the soundtrack for Live a Live and the English tracklist used on iTunes translated it as "Slaughter!" I'm not familiar with this game so I'm not sure if this was a mistranslation or a intentional localization choice. Apparently it plays in the "Bakumatsu Chapter -Secret Orders-" where the objective is to rescue some hostages by either evading the guards and traps or by killing 100 of them. The English title used on iTunes would certainly befit the latter option, but not so much the former.
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Old Jan 20, 2022, 06:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
I'm not sure if it really changes anything or not, but I can provide some more context since this track is only used for about 2 minutes in the OVA (this is the scene where it is used.)
Judging from anime context alone, that is indeed less sword fight and more slaughter. As for the Live-A-Live track which uses the same Kanji, it is a normal battle theme for that chapter.

Maybe "Sword Fight" and "Slaughter" are both correct. Based on my searches, in normal everyday use it refers to "Sword Fight" as in sword fight scenes in action movies, generally feudal era Japan sword fights. But depending on the context, "Slaughter" maybe can also be valid, which hints to the etymology of the word (i.e. 殺陣 used to be written as 殺人). The Kanji was changed because "murder" looks a bit serious and uneasy when you're just directing a movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazingAbyss View Post
Interestingly, while looking for other examples of "殺陣" I came across the soundtrack for Live a Live
I was reminded now of Final Fantasy IX's fake acting sword fight scene which I know is referred to in Japanese as チャンバラ, and that term is also considered a synonym to 殺陣.

As for "Murder Pentagram" as a possible translation, I still have no idea how that came about.
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  #9  
Old Feb 18, 2022, 11:03 PM
BlazingAbyss BlazingAbyss is offline
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I think I may have come up with another possible explanation. Unless I'm mistaken, you would typically pronounce "殺陣" as "tate" and not "satsujin" correct? If so then it would seem a bit strange to have it written out as "SATSU-JIN" and not "TATE." Here's what I think is going on, I think ""殺陣" is not meant to be the same title written out in Japanese, but instead simply a description of what the track was used for in the OVA, so in English it may instead look something like "Slaughter [Sword Fight]."

This would line up with the bracketed text for tracks 01, 02, 08 & 12 as they simply state what the song in question is the theme for and track 10's bracketed text doesn't appear to have any direct relation to the title that it's paired with. The only potential flaw in this theory are tracks 5 and 17 since as far as I can tell both the track title and the bracketed title mean the same things, they're just written out differently, thus I can't say with 100% that this isn't the case with track 11 as well.
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